[0:00]Is Goku above time? Before we dive into that, we actually have to understand what it means to be above time. Let's have the prerequisites that whenever I say the word time, I'm actually talking about space time in general, as time and space are intertwined and cannot exist without one another. A character can be scaled above time if they have a higher dimensional existence, or if their power and speed are on that level. Being higher dimensional in terms of existence or power is pretty self-explanatory. Just be capable of destroying a higher dimensional plane of existence or be composed of a body that pertains to at least four spatial dimensions and existing in a realm of equal spatial value. Whilst also taking into account the temporality of said dimension, for example, a higher dimension is just the addition of an extra spatial axis and imagine going from a square that's drawn inside of a screen that you can't touch no matter how many squares are stacked on top of each other within that screen to be in a full three-dimensional cube in the real world. That would be a perfect example of the addition of an extra spatial access of height. But what about measurable speed? Many people have the misconception that if you travel through time with quote unquote speed, then you would be immeasurable speed, but this is actually wrong. You're not really traveling through time using speed. More so, you're trading the temporal axis as if it were spatial, allowing you to hop on top of the timeline and travel through time like you're flipping through the pages of a book. It's similar to having access to a higher dimension, but just because a higher dimensional being would have measurable speed by default, by being faster than even infinite speed, but he can also move freely through time, doesn't mean that time travel now necessitates an immeasurable speed feat.
[1:40]When you time travel, you're entering a negative or positive coordinate of the timeline. Think of it as a number line that starts from -3 to +3. -3 represents the past and +3 represents the future. Same goes for every negative and positive value respectively, but at every moment, the present is always zero. Time travel doesn't grant immeasurable speed because time remains defined whether you travel backward or forward in time. It's still measurable. Traveling back in time is basically just accessing negative time, as those events already happened, hence you can still measure the time as the formula would just be speed is equal distance over -3 seconds. The formula doesn't break because the speed is still measurable. The same goes for positive time as well. Immeasurable speed would mean breaking the speed formula, where time is undefined. This would require traveling outside of time or to places where time doesn't exist. So just because you need a time machine to travel through time, doesn't necessarily mean you can't be immeasurable speed. Son Goku is a three-dimensional being. The series makes this very clear, so we know his existence isn't higher dimensional or outerversal. So how can a three-dimensional being be above time? We need to understand what key is in Dragon Ball. Toriyama states that the physical body has limitations, but through Key, these limitations can be overcome. This is evident as Dragon Ball characters have been able to destroy spacetime with their key on multiple occasions, so we know that key in of itself can be trained to be at a level where it can affect spacetime itself, which tells us that the potential of key is literally limitless. So if Goku possesses a Key, which he can constantly amp himself with, and said Key can destroy spacetime, then you can kind of already tell the conclusion. Goku can amp himself with a Key level that transcends time, and this is why Goku and Trunks can exist where time and space were completely erased on a conceptual level. Because his existence was being amped by his own Key aura, allowing him to exist where there is no spacetime. The argument I see being spammed around is that Zeno is the strongest being in all of Dragon Ball. And since Zeno has a future counterpart in another timeline, Goku and the others would all be bounded by time as a result, meaning nobody in Dragon Ball is even 5D. Everybody would just be 4D by default. But I don't think you understand why this argument is extremely horrible, because if Zeno was bound by time, he wouldn't even be 4D. Because 4D entails both the three spatial dimensions and the temporal dimension of time. So if he's bounded by spacetime, then he can't even be a 4D being. If a being can rip apart even a single centimeter of spacetime, then he's at least 4D. We know Zeno is massively stronger than characters who can destroy spacetime. Heck, we even see Zeno actually destroy spacetime, which is at least a 4D feat. Hence Zeno, just like Goku, could just also have a 3D existence but amp himself and his existence or physical stats with 4D or above levels of Key, allowing him to both destroy spacetime and exist without it. The terms "Zeno is bounded by time" are actually incredibly vague because even a 5D being is technically still bound by six-dimensional spacetime, and so on. Temporality is something that exists on every dimensional level, so you can be above conventional 4D spacetime and still be bounded by time. Another reason why this argument is absolutely ridiculous is because it undermines what timelines are in Dragon Ball. So let's explain it in details. What are the timelines in Dragon Ball? On multiple occasions, these timelines have been described as parallel worlds. It's been stated that significantly changing the past creates a parallel world, but it's not like a new timeline just appears out of nowhere, but that same timeline splits in two. It's like walking on a road and then you get to a point where the same road splits in two directions, but conceptually, it's still the exact same road. When Goku died of a heart virus, Trunks used a time machine to go back to the past to help Goku, which resulted in Goku surviving. This actually splits the history in two, because if it didn't, then there would be a paradox where Trunks going back to save Goku before he died results in Goku being alive in the past, hence there was never an event of Trunks going back in the past in the first place to save Goku, since Goku never died. But if there was never a Trunks going back in time and saving Goku, then Goku is dead, and if Goku is dead, then Trunks never went back to save Goku. You get the idea. So history necessarily splits in two, one where Goku is alive and the original history where Goku is dead, hence there is no paradox as this resolves it completely. This is why they are referred to as parallel worlds, not past events of the same history or timeline. Because changing the past of one timeline in Dragon Ball doesn't affect the original timeline at all. You just created a completely separate autonomous history that split from the original the instant a significant change that creates a paradox happens. And as I said, it's not like it's created from nowhere as the word create is just used as a metaphor. It's simply the original history being divided like a road as I explained earlier. And the thing with these histories is that they already have their own events that occurred. So it's not like they're created from the point where they are split because if something has existed eternally within one history and that history splits in two, the second history that's created has also always existed and always contained eternal things. As I said, it's not creating an entirely new timeline, it's just dividing an already existent one to logically resolve the paradox. This is why we say that Goku has no actual future or past counterparts, but completely separate autonomous Gokus that have no temporal connection to the Goku we know. So killing Goku in one timeline doesn't affect him in the other regardless of what time period you kill that Goku. You cannot create a past version of Goku because attempting to do so in Dragon Ball just creates a parallel world. If you killed someone who was 20 years old in Goku's timeline, it wouldn't affect the person at an older age in 20 years in Trunks's timeline because history has been split. Hence there are two separate continuities from each other, so they are not at all connected. This is why Zeno of the Trunks's timeline, who is supposed to be 17 years in the future, had no idea who Goku was because the Universe 6 tournament never took place in that history, neither did the tournament of power. Even though that version of Zeno is set in the world 17 years into the so-called future, he's a completely separate Zeno, hence as a result, Zeno was never actually shown being bounded by time.
[7:43]So that argument fails. Oh, but Drip Sauce, what about the afterlife though? If Otherworld is outerversal, then how come it's recreated by a temporal change or being affected by spacetime splitting itself? We clearly see the gods in these timelines, hence Otherworld and the realms above it have to exist to accommodate them. Hence they will be bounded by spacetime as a result. The counter to this argument is not very simple, so I'll explain it in a way that you can all understand it using four basic premises. The first premise we have is the prerequisite is that the timeline is abstract in nature as it contains abstract outerversal realms such as Otherworld and the realms that transcend the macrocosms. So it's a conceptual story containing abstract realms. The second premise is that a timeline also takes the physical events into consideration. So not only are there these outerversal realms in the timeline, but there's also spacial realms that exist conceptually below these outer realms, which also have events in them. The third premise is that the timeline is the total history of all events put together. So it includes the events in the outerversal realms and the events in the physical realms as well. The reason events can happen in outerversal realms is very simple. Causality isn't something that's dependent on the existence of spacetime, as time is simply the flow of events within a space. However, for an outerversal realm, we can have a temporal events, like an outerversal being creating another outerversal being in an outerversal realm. This doesn't mean they're bound by time or they aren't outer or anything like that, because there was an event of one creating the other. The event still happened within the narrative, independent of spacetime, so it falls under the category of an atemporal event. And even if you want to argue that outer realms having events is contradictory, I can just argue that contradictions can exist in fictional narratives. For example, a square circle cannot exist in real life, but I can write about a square circle in the story, which means that within my narrative, it exists. As fiction, by definition, is something that isn't real, aka a square circle. A logicalities can exist within narratives determined by the author. If you think otherwise, you're an idiot, unfortunately, and I mean this very, very offensively, go back to school. Premise 4 is that any physical event also has logical implications. For example, if I die in one timeline, I go to the afterlife, which is outerversal. But if you go back in time and save me from dying, it means that I never went to the afterlife, which is an outerversal realm, and that has logical implications, because if you changed the event of me dying when you go to the past, I never went to Otherworld.
[10:11]So then how am I already in Otherworld in the present? This is why Dragon Ball adopted some elements from a parallel world system called the Many Worlds interpretation, but it didn't actually follow it one to one. So there exists a world where I'm already in Otherworld and a world where I'm not. This changing of a physical event has logical implications as logically within the plot, I should be in Otherworld, but I'm not. So this paradox has to be resolved by having another Otherworld, logically speaking, not physically. The conclusion is that changing physical events has logical implications, which are going to entail new timelines. And new timelines by default entail abstract realms. Basically, outerversal structures, like I explained earlier, also follow changes and events when someone changes something physical. Remember, it's not because of the physical causality, but because now this action has logical implications, which are going to hit the timeline as a whole. Logically and not physically, affecting these outerversal realms as well, in a way that doesn't at all contradict their outerversal nature. Now that we've addressed that argument, we need to talk about other things that people used to argue against Goku or Dragon Ball's cosmology being above time in general. People say that Whis quote unquote turned back time, which affected Goku and also affected Otherworld as everyone who died was brought back to life. Now, if you watched this series or read the manga, I'm pretty sure you'd understand why this argument is incredibly stupid. Whis specifically says that he wasn't changing the past, but revisiting choices that were made. Essentially, Whis isn't actually turning back time to change the past, which is why a new timeline isn't actually created, but what he's essentially explaining to Bulma is the fact that he's rewinding the entire Multiverse, the entire timeline to a previous state. He's rewinding and turning back the plot itself to that specific point. Otherwise, Whis wouldn't make the comment to Bulma that he wasn't turning back time. So the angels basically have the ability to rewrite the plot itself, which is why it's only limited to three minutes, because it's not a time travel ability, and it's obviously completely broken. But let's say Whis actually did turn back time. This wouldn't even create any contradictions for neither Goku nor Otherworld, as Dragon Ball characters can use hacks abilities on you as long as they're more powerful than you. Whis can use time hacks abilities on Goku because Goku is a three-dimensional being. And if you're relative or stronger than Goku, then you can use a higher than three-dimensional hacks on him and it would work, regardless of Goku having outerversal power. Because you would be amping that higher dimensional time hacks with outerversal levels of Key. The Key you're using to initiate the attack is of an outerversal level, hence you can use it against him. This is why Hit can also use his time skip on Goku and Goku had to overpower his ability, not outspeed or outhacks, but overpower. Also, for the Otherworld thing, you can just make the argument that the souls have to travel to Otherworld. So Whis reversed their souls back to their bodies before they were able to reach Otherworld, simple as that. The other argument I see being used is that Goku still depends heavily on instant transmission, so how can he be above time and speed? Firstly, this argument presupposes that instant transmission has a set speed like infinite or inaccessible speed, which doesn't exist by the way, but this is actually false. Instant transmission takes you to a place that's stated to transcend time. And when we see the Supreme Kai teleporting with Goku in this same realm, implying that the Kais have access to it as well with their Kai Kai technique, Goku falls into the Sugoroku space, after they get hit by Baby's attack inside of this realm. This is insane because the Sugoroku space is actually stated to be contained in a realm that has no concepts of time and space. This realm also contains the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, and it's stated to exist between dimensions multiple times. Between dimensions in this context refers to the fact that it encompasses and separates these dimensions. With the information given for the instant transmission realm, we know it's outerversal by definition. So what makes you move at a relevant speed, which is not in any way an anti-feat for Goku, because you can have tears of irrelevant speed. We know that Toriyama cannot comprehend something actually being faster than instant, because in Toriyama's mind, something happening instantly is the fastest that something can ever be. So he believes that instant transmission is still faster than Goku's conventional speed, and if that's the case, then the word instant doesn't inherently have to mean something that caps at infinite speed, as the word instant itself is pretty vague. If a being with irrelevant speed still views a certain technique as being instant compared to his speed, then that just means that that technique makes you move at a higher level of irrelevant speed. But it doesn't even have to be faster, to be honest. It can still be the same speed as Goku or even slower, and it really wouldn't matter, because the main benefit of instant transmission is that it makes your energy undetectable, allowing you to catch your opponents off guard, because they can't track your movements at all. Because you're not moving in the living world when you use instant transmission. Instant transmission is used for convenience, and it's such an iconic move that Toriyama never even thought of dropping it. But as a result, even without all the information we have about instant transmission taking to an outerversal realm, it would still just upscale the speed of instant transmission. Another argument I see is that Whis is the fastest and he takes time to travel the universe, yada, yada, yada. Firstly, we don't even know exactly where Beerus's planet is located. For all we do know, it's in a completely different dimension where if you fall, there is no escape. So Whis travels from a different dimension all the time whenever he's coming to Earth, which means his travel speed is at least immeasurable speed, because going from one infinite dimension to the other requires crossing the higher dimensional axis between those dimensions. We also know that Toriyama cannot comprehend something actually being faster than instant, because in Toriyama's mind, something happening instantly is the fastest that something can ever be. And Beerus even calls Whis's travel speed slow. We even see Whis being able to travel to Otherworld pretty quickly, which we know is outerversal, so that would just be an irrelevant speed feat pretty easily. So I'm pretty sure the statement about it being Whis's maximum speed is just plot induced stupidity where Whis was just bluffing. Same with the Gas incident. You have to note that Toriyama isn't just writing Dragon Ball for the purpose of scaling, but for the purpose of telling a story as well. So if he made Goku casually able to instantly arrive at anywhere he wanted with his speed in a plot, it would cause Dragon Ball to be a lot less entertaining and feel a lot more like these boring, unknown, irrelevant Versus that people always compared to Goku. But Toriyama will show Goku performing an immeasurable or relevant speed feat, then somehow limit him down to MFTL plus for the sake of the plot, which is obviously plot induced stupidity. In a Versus battle, there is no plot. The authors of either characters do not influence the fight since it occurs in a neutral space that isn't Dragon Ball or the opponent character's verse. Hence Goku wouldn't be limited by said plot and would be able to use his relevant speed with no limitations. Jiren transcends time. Time means nothing to him. Stated by Vados and Supreme Kai, two incredibly reliable characters in Dragon Ball, and nobody amongst the gods or the entire audience disagrees with them in the Tournament of Power. More so, it's stated that their speed was super dimensional, which we all know what that means. It's pretty easy to argue Goku is above time. The arguments against it are just recycled bullshit from people who don't understand Dragon Ball. What's up, guys? It's your boy Drip Sauce. And if you learned anything new today, please be sure to like and subscribe and turn on notifications so you never miss an upload. I make sure to share the people who think Goku is bound by time and let them know the truth. And don't forget to join the Discord. The link will be pinned in the comment section below. All right, guys, peace out.
