[0:00]So you're the one complaining about praying to Mary? Not complaining. I just wanted to know where to find it. I can't remember the history. Why would you need to find something black and white in order for it to be true? Because by your criterion you're going to argue yourself outside of Christianity. You're arguing like a son of the devil. No. Can I explain or are you going to talk over me? Thank you. Okay. Muslims tell me, show me where Jesus says, I am God or worship me and then I'll become a Christian. So now how do you answer that? Can you repeat it? Muslims tell me, show me where Jesus says, I am God or worship me in those exact words in the Bible and I'll become a Christian. So how do you answer that when they tell you that? Well, first I believe what the Bible says. If Jesus says that then I'm going to hold to it. Where does he say it? You still don't get it. John 8. No, he did. Before Abraham was, I am. Jonathan, you're not listening. I'm going to embarrass you. Let me repeat the question again. You're not listening, pretend you're listening. Don't be so full of yourself thinking you got the question. The question wasn't show me where you think Jesus implies his deity. The question the Muslim ask is, show me where Jesus says, I am God or worship me and I'll become a Christian. Now can you show me that from the Bible? Where Jesus says I am God or worship me and I'll become a Christian. Is that- Is that what I got right? Yep. Okay. Where? Either way. Because that's your mind. I haven't had a lot of conversations with Muslims. I usually do at Jehovah's Witnesses. Um, though I usually like to go to the can you answer the question? See you're you're diverting again. You're wasting my time, dude. I'm trying to understand the question. Say it again. I'm trying to understand it. I'm sorry. Okay, third time, Jonathan. Why are you here? I don't know. Can you go to my channel because I was just- I'm honestly I don't want sugar. I'm going to I'm going to repeat it a third time. I just wanted to know the history. I want to put it to the timeline. Jonathan, can I ask you something, are you a son of the devil? Are you full of the devil that you can't understand logic? No, I'm a Trinitarian all the way. Okay, can you then hear my argument? Because only someone demonized doesn't listen to answer accurately because Jesus said he's the God of truth, so we need to be truthful with your adopting satanic tactics. So I'm going to test you. Let's see. Let's let me test you to see if you really have the Holy Spirit. Listen better than you speak. Trying to be patient with you. Okay. Your criterion in demanding that the Bible has to be written a certain way proves too much. So let me repeat it. The Muslim tells me he'll be a Christian, if I can show him where Jesus, I am God or worship me in those exact words. So now I'm going to play the role of Muslim because that's the game you're playing with me. Show me where Jesus I am God in those exact words. Okay, he doesn't say in those exact words, I am God. So then is the Muslim right to then reject the deity of Christ? No. Why? Because the principles are there in the Bible. Say it again. Say it again. The principles are in the Bible. One more time. The principles are there clearly stated in the Bible that Jesus is not only the son of God. Say I just gave you enough rope to hang yourself. I don't need to show you an explicit verse where I'm told to pray to the saints in heaven or Mary because the principles are there in the Bible that LED the church before you existed to the same conclusion. See what I did? That's what I'm trying to learn though. So- I'm trying to learn from you because I can't remember it all. Oh, okay, I'll help you now. I'll help you. Now that you agreed with me that you don't need to find something black and white because that's not how the Bible is written. But you look at the Bible, see how it's written and then derive principles and arrive at conclusions. Now we're talking. Now do you have your Bible ready?
[3:53]Okay. Okay, okay. Go to Ephesians 6:19 and 20. Here are the principles that LED the church before I existed before you existed. Those who knew the apostles, who were appointed by the apostles, their successors were given the scriptures to preserve. Those individuals came to the conclusion based on these verses saints are perfected, they're alive, and they pray for us so we can ask their intercession. Now you may disagree, but let's look at the evidence first. Okay, Ephesians 6:19-20. Yeah. And also for me, the words that words may be given to me in opening my mouth boldly to proclaim the mystery of the gospel for which I am an ambassador in chains that I may declare it boldly as I ought to speak. Now, did you read from Ephesians 6? Yes, from the ESV. Yep, 19-20. Read 17-20. Let's add 17-19. Sorry. My apologies. Sorry about that guys. Sometimes too much information overload. May the Lord give me the grace to recall Ephesians 6:17-20 so we can know what the context of 19-20 is. Are you there? Are you reading? I can't hear no sound. No sound, Jonathan. Jonathan, he left. Sorry, whenever I open my Bible app it shuts off the sound. Where are you on online? Yeah, I'm using my phone. Okay, let me help you then. I'll read them for because it's going to be easier if I do it because I don't want you to look Ephesians 6:17-20. And take the element of salvation, the sword of spirit, which is word of God. Pray at all times in the spirit, meaning in union with the spirit, let spirit guide you to pray with all prayer and supplication. To that end, keep alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints. So we are commanded to pray for all believers, right? Correct, the principle. Before you jump the gun, say, oh yeah, but they're dead. We'll get there. So we need to supplicate pray for all the saints and also for me that utterance may be given me in opening my mouth boldly to proclaim the mystery of the gospel. For which I'm an ambassador in chains that I may declare it boldly as I ought to speak. So what we established here, and I got more, I'm just giving you one. I think I got it now. What is it? I just said I think I'm I'm starting to see what you're saying in principle. And the principle is, believers must pray for one another and pray even for the salvation of those who are not saved. That's something we do if we love the Lord, love one another. Now let me give you another one. I'm going to read this for you, ready? Sure. James 5:13-20. James 5:13-20. Okay. I'm going to read it for you. You don't need to so you don't lose connection. Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is any cheerful? Let him sing praise. Is any among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church and let them pray over him. Anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord and the prayer of faith will save that sick man and the Lord will raise him up and if he's committed sins, he'll be forgiven. So here's another principle, elders, who are appointed to oversee the flock can pray for you and I if we're sick and anoint us with the oil of the people and if we've sin we confess it to the elders and God will then take our confession and the prayers of the elders and heal us. So here we have believers praying for the wellbeing and the forgiveness of Christians. Let me finish it though. Therefore confess your sins one another and pray for one another, confess your sins to one another, pray for one another that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects. Let me repeat that part again. The prayer of a righteous man, the more you submit to the spirit, the more you walk in fellowship with the spirit, the less you sin, the more powerful your prayers to God. Because sin hinders your prayers and I'll establish that. I'll give you that proof. Just let me take it step at a time. The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects. Elijah was a man of like nature with ourselves and he prayed fervently that it might not rain and for three years and six months, it did not rain on the Earth. Then he prayed again and the heaven gave rain and the Earth brought forth its fruit. My brethren if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul. So God uses you and works through you to save souls from death and cover a multitude of sins. So here's the principle we just established. I got a few more. Someone who walks with the spirit more obediently, sins less, his powers become more, his prayers become more powerful and effectual than someone in sin who's not repented. Now here's the proof. Psalm 66:18. Are you ready? Yep. Yep. Psalm 66:18. If I had cherished iniquity in my heart, the Lord would not have listened. Did you understand that principle? Yes. Yes. If you are desiring sin and you're harboring sin and you're in sin, your prayers become less effective and powerful. The less you sin, the more you obey, the more powerful your prayers. Keep that in mind. We've established two things. Christians are to pray for one another if they love the Lord, love one another, and a righteous servant of the Lord who submits to the Lord, his prayers become more powerful and bring results, whether healing or salvation. Okay, now a few more just like you ask me. It's not a one minute response. Thank you. Okay, now. Revelation 8:3-5. Revelation 8:3-5. Now watch this, and another angel, Revelation 8:3-5, came and stood at the altar with a golden censer. And he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne. So notice, here's an angel before the heavenly altar. He's got incense to offer to God and the prayers of the saints. He's carrying the prayers of believers to God with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne. And the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God. So he's offering the prayers of believers, the saints with incense to God as an acceptable offering. Then the angel took the censer and filled it with fire from the altar and threw it on the earth and there were pearls, peels of thunder, voices, flashes of lightning and an earthquake. So so let me ask you a question. We've established that we pray for one another and the more righteous you are, the less sinful you are, the more powerful your prayers and God takes your prayers to heal and save people. We also establish you have at least angels that when you pray they take your prayers to God and hand them over to God. You with me so far? Yes, sir. Okay. Do you agree that when someone is in the I don't know if what you believe about death and afterlife. Do you agree that when someone who's in Christ dies and he goes to heaven that person is now sinless, no more sin and he's perfect and complete? Yes. Yes. Now with this principle, if they are alive in heaven and they are aware of what takes place on Earth and they are still part of the body, the church, and they still love us for the sake of the Lord. And while we're on Earth, we pray for one another, is it possible that because they're alive and perfect and sinless they're praying for the members of the body of Christ on Earth and their prayers would be even more powerful than yours and mine? I guess it's possible. Something that I don't have a clear picture of though in principle, it's possible. Yes, because I'm going to show you they're aware of things on Earth. I just wanted you to follow me. Now another example of your prayers being hindered because of sin, first Peter 3:7. Uh huh. Likewise, you husbands, first Peter 3:7, live considerately with your wives, bestowing honor on the woman as the weaker sex since you are joint heirs of the favor of life in order that your prayers not be hindered. So here's a warning. Your wife who's a joint heir of salvation. If you dishonor her and you offend her or hurt her, your prayers will be hindered. See that principle? Yes. The more you sin, the less effective your prayer. The more righteous, the more powerful your prayer. Now those in heaven, are they perfect? Hebrews 12:22-24. Hebrews 12:22-24. But you have come to Mount Zion. And to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. This is in heaven, right? Correct, heavenly Jerusalem. And to innumerable angels, multitudes of angels in festal gathering. Now watch who else is in heaven. And to the church of the firstborn who enrolled in heaven. There's church there.
[13:38]Church, there's a church in heaven. Now before I finish it, what do we do in church? Besides listening to the word of God, we also minister to one another, pray for one another and for one another. Yes, sir. So if they're having church in heaven, and they know they're connected to, because we're one body, born of one spirit, one body born of one spirit.
[14:04]You think they stop praying for their brothers and sisters who are still struggling in the flesh and persecution on Earth? Probably unlikely. I'm going to show you they do pray, but you get it, right? If you have church in heaven, it's like you have church on Earth and we're one church born of one spirit, one body. And Jesus says love one another as I have loved you and we pray for one another because we love one another. Then you've established the principle that the church there, because their love is perfect for one another, that means their love is perfect for us on Earth and there is no greater display of perfect love than to pray for your brothers and sisters in need. Let me finish it because now notice it says they're perfect. And to the church of the firstborn who enrolled in heaven and to a judge who's God of all and to the spirits, because their bodies are in the dust, of just men made perfect.
[15:00]The spirits of the believers who died, their spirits are in heavenly Jerusalem, not their bodies because their bodies went to the dust awaiting the resurrection, and it says they're now perfect, complete. They have thrown off the burn of sin and if they are perfect, that means their prayers are perfect, their love is perfect and perfect prayers are accepted to God and answered. And you also come to Jesus, the mediator of a new Covenant and to the sprinkle of blood that speaks more graciously than the blood of Abel. So they're not dead, they're alive, they're perfect, they're sinless, they're still the church, their love for us is perfect, their prayers are perfect, which means that if they're part of the church and they now love me perfectly not imperfectly cause on Earth we love each other imperfectly. That means perfect love means they still care for me and are still praying for me and their prayers because it's not hindered by sin, gets more results than my prayer and yours that is often hindered by sin.
